The Real Issue with CN

[Jeff]

I'm guessing the reason with CN's gradual slide away from classic cartoon programming and into new programming is really due to advertiser's perception (based on ratings) of new programming being better than old, fading prints of cartoons.

So this begs the question is whether there is a different model that could be used. Feature-film channels use the pay-per-view concept for their main revenue stream as opposed to advertisers.

Could such a model be used for classic programming? The main problem with that is the length of such programming is significantly less (1/2 hour down to a few minutes) makes the viewer's administration more difficult and how much do you charge for such programming to a user?

I wonder if such a study has been done? I could see it working for us aficianado's: Imagine being able to schedule up your favourite episode of The Honeymooners, followed by your favourite 3 Bosko cartoons, a specific Flip the Frog cartoon and top it off with a couple Little Rascals & Stooges shorts. Of course, the real collector's would only order such programming once and record it, and then never have to pay for it again ;)

Any other thoughts?

Regards,
Jeff

[Matt Wilson]

The real issue is that cable providers do not consider classic animation to have a market, and that is why they don't pick up Boomerang. And that is why Boomerang is failing, and that's why CN is trying to increase demand by pulling all classic animation from the network. They're losing so much money on Boomerang because cable providers make the unfair discrimination that noone could possibly be interested in old animation. And it doesn't even matter what the schedule is, even if it's 8 hours of the very best theatrical shorts from every distributor and studio, cable providers just don't know or care. And yet these same cable companies love TV Land to death, and said network has an installed base of well over 50 million customers. It's frustrating beyond the point of insanity.

[Thad]

even if it's 8 hours of the very best theatrical shorts from every distributor and studio
You just stated the #1 problem. Cable providers aren't going to pick up a channel that plays only 8 hours of programming a day, they want channels that have at least 18 hours of new material that isn't recycled. Boomerang has been running itself into the ground anyway with stunts like "Scooberang"...


-Thad

[Mek]

Boomerang has been running itself into the ground anyway with stunts like "Scooberang"...


-Thad
Ain't that the truth.

I think it's pretty sad that the cable networks -and even CN to an extent- are underestimating a sizeable majority of the viewers when it comes to animation. A classic cartoon can be just as funny -if not moreso- than your standard animated fare on TV these days. =/

[Mackaybear]

Well it's not like Boomerang is doing such a great job in and of itself. This 8 hours of programming repeated three times a day isn't very good. Espcially considering what they used to do and the amount of programming they do have.

And I've hit the wall with Comcast. They don't think Boomerang has enough potential viewers but will add Nickelodeon 2 which basically just repeats Nick. If it was HD I could almost see it. But it isn't. But despite my local Comcast office telling me they've gotten over 100 requests for Boomerang in the last three years they still don't think it will bring in enough viewers.

If I could afford to move I'd get a place that would let me put up a dish and go back to Dish Network.

[Mike]

And yet these same cable companies love TV Land to death, and said network has an installed base of well over 50 million customers. It's frustrating beyond the point of insanity.
It's not that difficult to figure out. The key difference is TV Land was always a 24-hour network. Cartoon Network can show commercials for Boomerang all they want, encouraging people to call their cable company to get it, but the fact of the matter is, if the product isn't there, the channel isn't going to be a hit. Why should the cable companies waste a channel space on a station that only programs 8 hours a day? It also shows contempt for the audience, programming just for 8 hours a day and then repeating the bloc twice. It's like they're figuring the audience will watch anything. Boomerang could easily program 24 hours a day; there's no reason why they shouldn't. There's really no reason why the channel's programming day can't look like CN's did in 1992. They should have been a 24-hour network right out of the gate. The network probably would be a success by now.

If Boomerang fails, it won't be the cable companies' fault. It'll be CN's, for displaying a half-hearted interest in Boomerang right from the beginning.

Mike

[mbaker]

I think the problem with Boomerang is that in addition to all the gold nuggets from the Hanna-Barbera library, they also aired all the junk that most of us would rather forget. (Even if they were guilty pleasures to some of us) I think what they needed was more gold nuggets in their lineup so that the channel would look somewhat more attractive to cable providers. Boomerang could've been the animation equivilant to TV Land, but Time Warner missed the oppertunity to present that channel in such a way.

You would think that cable providers would get the fact that people are tuning off the Big 4 Networks (Fox, ABC, CBS, NBC) because they're NOT happy with the likes of "Friends", countless reality shows, and a half-million legal drama/cop shows and that people want to watch the old shows they grew up with or still love in addition to alternative programming! (like animation) Now, Cable is trying to compete with the broadcast network junk with junk of their own. Leaving older shows out of the equasion. Until more alternatives to Cartoon Network, Nicktoons, and Toon Disney show up, we'll just have to settle for our DVD collections.

[The Silver Fox]

comcast if you cable company was a former TCI/at & T cable provider is worse. The never add anythng new that anyone really wants. for almost 10 yrs i been calling to try to get Toon Disney added to the standard/expanded non digital cable and they refuse putting it on a package that you need to pay near a 100 a month to get, and to this day we can't get boomerang at all, either cable or Dish in the pueblo area. They say there no market, oh please. Explain how the cable/dish providers in this area can add a sports or news network to the channels but not the ones we want. Also anyone seen the network Pax, that is worse then boomerang's 8 hrs of programming, Pax has 12 hours of informercials and 10 hr programming, something is WAY wrong there. How many times do anyone want to see the real estate marketing commercial???


I think all the good networks have gone down the tubes last few years, DIsney with the droping of Vault disney, CN droping all classic line up for a Craptoon fest, Nick's terible line up of bad toons, TD i heard droping alot of the Disney afternoon cartoons, and now playing POorly done half baked toons as DAve the barbarien, and Wiskers, something is very wrong..
even Nick at nite beencut back to starting in my area at 9 PM and they go back to Nick at 4 am, there somethign wrong with the programers. In this day of stress and threats, we need good entertaiment to forget what times we are living thru.
:ysam:

[mbaker]

comcast if you cable company was a former TCI/at & T cable provider is worse. The never add anythng new that anyone really wants. for almost 10 yrs i been calling to try to get Toon Disney added to the standard/expanded non digital cable and they refuse putting it on a package that you need to pay near a 100 a month to get, and to this day we can't get boomerang at all, either cable or Dish in the pueblo area. They say there no market, oh please. Explain how the cable/dish providers in this area can add a sports or news network to the channels but not the ones we want. Also anyone seen the network Pax, that is worse then boomerang's 8 hrs of programming, Pax has 12 hours of informercials and 10 hr programming, something is WAY wrong there. How many times do anyone want to see the real estate marketing commercial???


I think all the good networks have gone down the tubes last few years, DIsney with the droping of Vault disney, CN droping all classic line up for a Craptoon fest, Nick's terible line up of bad toons, TD i heard droping alot of the Disney afternoon cartoons, and now playing Poorly done half baked toons as Dave the barbarien, and Wiskers, something is very wrong..
even Nick at nite beencut back to starting in my area at 9 PM and they go back to Nick at 4 am, there somethign wrong with the programers. In this day of stress and threats, we need good entertaiment to forget what times we are living thru.
:ysam:
Toon Disney could've been their answer to Cartoon Network, but they've removed the classic Disney shorts, dumped the Disney Afternoon classics to lousy time slots, and give all the crappy shows the most attention. They don't even air the good Disney classics made before 1985? Their Jetix block could've been Disney's answer to Toonami, but dosen't even hold a candle to it. (Let's not even talk about the inclusion of "Power Rangers" to that channel. It's not even a cartoon for cryin' out loud!!) The only decent shows on that block are "Gargoyles", and Spider-Man". Toon Disney could've been made into a great channel, but Disney fails to put it use it to it's fullest potential.

[corey3rd]

Right now I have an on demand channel that supposed to have content provided by Cartoon Network and Boomerang. While Comedy Central always has about two dozen selections, CN provides nothing. It's an empty drawer. It would be so easy for them to dump some of their classic content onto this channel and keep people happy, but nope.

The good news is that more and more classic cartoons are coming to DVD so you're not a slave to a bean counting programmer. Disney is putting out most of their theatrical shorts on the Treasures series. I'm never going to have to wonder when the Jetsons will show on TV. Although I will have to wonder when other titles are getting released.

Although CN is necessary to move the boxsets. I wasn't too interested in the upcoming Top Cat, but after watching a couple on CN's Boomerang hour, I'm interested in nabbing it.

[mbaker]

While i enjoy some of the Cartoon Cartoons like "Dexter's Laboratory", "Johnny Bravo", "The Powerpuff Girls", and "Billy & Mandy", the lineup is a far cary to what it use to be. I'm also bothered by the fact that "Pokemon", and "Yu-Gi-Oh" are on primetime durring the week. Seriously, there are better shows that deserve those timeslots than that junk. :wolfie: