Song of the south

[tristar]

What's the story on song of the south? Why can't we see it? Have any of you guys seen it? And yes, I am aware that it may come out on a legacy set, but why has it gone unseen for so long?

Best regards,
Morty

[Sogturtle]

What's the story on song of the south? Why can't we see it? Have any of you guys seen it? And yes, I am aware that it may come out on a legacy set, but why has it gone unseen for so long?

Best regards,
Morty

Tristar/Morty~

It's simple really... Many modern African-Americans are grossly offended by the live-action parts of the film. Soooo to avoid offending further, Disney opted to simply bury the film, despite its comparatively recent theatrical re-releases here. And it never appeared on AMERICAN home video for that reason. Most of us have seen it or own copies obtained here or there;).

[Duck Dodgers]

Am I the only one to think that THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO POLITICAL INCORRECTNESS in this movie?
It's the exact contrary, folks!

[Ray Pointer]

SONG OF THE SOUTH was re-released by popular demand in 1972. The controversy is exaggerated and silly, as there are far less offensive stereotypes in SONG OF THE SOUTH than in GONE WITH THE WIND. At no time is there a reference to slavery or the use of terms such as "darkie" as in GWTW. In fact the period of SOUNG OF THE SOUTH is post-Civil War reconstruction. A fact of history is that many elderly ex-slaves continued to live at the levels they did as slaves except that they were free citizens. The point that is being missed here
is that Uncle Remus is a positive balsck role, natural character in character with simple, home spun wisdom who helps the boy understand life through his colorful stories about B'er Rabbit, B'er Fox, and B'er Bear. This is a purely original evolution of Americana, and to obscure it is to osbure history. And to deny that such people existed pertuates ignorance and an unrealistic perspective on the human condition.

[tristar]

Thanks for the info!
But maybe this might be a reason Disney won't release it: it was made for kids, and kids would take there things more seriously than adults. But still, they could put an intro about the stereotypes, and tell parents to talk more about the dangers of racism with their kids.

But on the web, I once searched for Song of the south DVD. And there were websites for them! Could they be bootlegs? Are thay worth reporting?

-Morty

[Sogturtle]

Thanks for the info!
But maybe this might be a reason Disney won't release it: it was made for kids, and kids would take there things more seriously than adults. But still, they could put an intro about the stereotypes, and tell parents to talk more about the dangers of racism with their kids.

But on the web, I once searched for Song of the south DVD. And there were websites for them! Could they be bootlegs? Are thay worth reporting?

-Morty

Tristar/Morty~

The bulk of its animated sequences actually don't even NEED the live-action story *(okay besides the "Zip A Dee Doo Dah" mixed live-action animated scene of Uncle Remus against a full animated scene).

And yesssss there are "Song Of The South" DVDs floating around out there. All of them are pirate copies deriving from the legit Japanese laserdisc or European release. When you say "are they worth reporting" I'm not sure if you mean talking about their quality or reporting them to Disney...:confused:

[Sogturtle]

Am I the only one to think that THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO POLITICAL INCORRECTNESS in this movie?
It's the exact contrary, folks!

My friend Duck Dodgers/Andrea~

A LOT of people from OUTSIDE of the United States will agree with you on that, as well as a huge percent of "Anglos" living in the U.S. The problem is that almost ANY depiction of African-Americans from the classic film era is now viewed as politically incorrect.

What Ray said was correct, it is all blown up hugely out of proportion and out of the intended context of the film. BUT Disney has been made hyper-sensitive about offending people.

[tristar]

By reporting it, I ment "should we tell Disney?"

But I really hope that Disney would put out Song of the south on a legacy set. It looks like such a nice movie! But I'm very happy that Oswald is coming out on a set. When it comes out, I'm getting my copy!

[Sogturtle]

By reporting it, I ment "should we tell Disney?"

But I really hope that Disney would put out Song of the south on a legacy set. It looks like such a nice movie! But I'm very happy that Oswald is coming out on a set. When it comes out, I'm getting my copy!

Tristar~

Disney UNDOUBTEDLY knows about it, and just DOESN'T want to draw more attention to the film's existence (and create MORE negative publicity) by taking action against the guys. Think controvery versus "extremely small potatoes" here;).

[sumnernor]

There has been at least 1 thread in the GAC forum - look at:

http://forums.goldenagecartoons.com/showthread.php?t=5814

[Mark J]

SONG OF THE SOUTH was re-released by popular demand in 1972. The controversy is exaggerated and silly, as there are far less offensive stereotypes in SONG OF THE SOUTH than in GONE WITH THE WIND. At no time is there a reference to slavery or the use of terms such as "darkie" as in GWTW.

Not the best argument - GWTW is, in my opinion, the most offensive and racist mainstream sound film ever released (maybe surpassed only by the blackface 'Check and Double Check' - the Amos and Andy movie), with it's longing for the 'good old days' of slavery. It really tries to convince you that black people loved being slaves and white slave owners were benevolent gentlemen who took care of their lazy shiftless slaves, and that the Union army was composed of degenerate criminals who destroyed the south. Being less offensive than that is not difficult. I saw Song of the South in the movies when I was a kid and found the worst part was it was boring - that is it's biggest offense. Almost as boring as Fantasia, a film which was so boring it caused me to run out of the theatre at age 10 and still bores me.

[Treadwell]

it's longing for the 'good old days' of slavery. It really tries to convince you that black people loved being slaves and white slave owners were benevolent gentlemen who took care of their lazy shiftless slaves

The heck it does. But to go on would be off topic.

[JPox]

The animated segments are great in this movie. I really like the scene where Uncle Remus and the frog are fishing.
But I do agree, the rest of the film is somewhat slow.

[MarkTheShark]

The heck it does. But to go on would be off topic.

Sorry for pushing this over the "off-topic cliff." But it reminds me of the night I got an IM out of the blue, from some nut job I didn't even know, asking me about Sesame Street and The Electric Company. (I'd posted on some boards that I had some episodes.) I mentioned that Archie and Edith Bunker appeared in one of the TEC shows I have. This wack job then tried to "debate" me over "All In The Family." What a horrible show it was, and I said I had enjoyed it when I watched it while I was growing up. He/she/it then took me to task over how I could enjoy a show "that promotes racism." Ummmmm...I think this individual missed the whole point of the show, no?

[Ray Pointer]

Not the best argument - GWTW is, in my opinion, the most offensive and racist mainstream sound film ever released (maybe surpassed only by the blackface 'Check and Double Check' - the Amos and Andy movie), with it's longing for the 'good old days' of slavery. It really tries to convince you that black people loved being slaves and white slave owners were benevolent gentlemen who took care of their lazy shiftless slaves, and that the Union army was composed of degenerate criminals who destroyed the south. Being less offensive than that is not difficult. I saw Song of the South in the movies when I was a kid and found the worst part was it was boring - that is it's biggest offense. Almost as boring as Fantasia, a film which was so boring it caused me to run out of the theatre at age 10 and still bores me.

If you mean the NAACP's "argument" is not the best, fine. Regarding the characters in GONE WITH THE WIND, the fact is that there were people like that, so this is not a slur, nor a necessarily intended stereotype. BIRTH OF A NATION is far more contorverisal than GWTW or CHECK AND DOUBLE CHECK. But regarding the old south and movies on this subject, there are inaccuracies about the social structure of slaves from "House Servants" to "Field Hands." What most of them always show is literally a "black and white" view of the relationship of slave and master. All you see is dark-skinned "negroes," and no mulattoes. The fact is that the mulattos worked in the household due to "fairer" features. Very few movies have ever addressed this historical fact of mixed race and miscegenation. IMITATION OF LIFE, the original SHOW BOAT, and A BAND OF ANGELS are among the few that have.
BIRTH OF A NATION put out a very uncomforable image of mulattoes being disloyal and unscrupulous as in the character of Silas Lynch, who is constantly referred to in title cards as "The Mulatto."

Regarding SONG OF THE SOUTH, the live action sequences do seem a bit dull
compared to the animated fantasies. I recall the audience, mostly children brought by their parents getting restless during these sections. But being bored and being offended have nothing to do with each other unless it is a priority that one must be kept stimulated every second of the day. Perhaps there is some confused reasoning here.

[samtheq]

[QUOTE=Sogturtle]My friend Duck Dodgers/Andrea~

A LOT of people from OUTSIDE of the United States will agree with you on that, as well as a huge percent of "Anglos" living in the U.S. The problem is that almost ANY depiction of African-Americans from the classic film era is now viewed as politically incorrect.

QUOTE]

And the irony is, of course, that the "gangsta rap" portrayal of blacks in music videos and the like, including glorification of drugs, violent crime, and degredation of women, is completely acceptable. Go figure...

[J. J. Hunsecker]

And the irony is, of course, that the "gangsta rap" portrayal of blacks in music videos and the like, including glorification of drugs, violent crime, and degredation of women, is completely acceptable. Go figure...
A lot of "gangsta rap" IS controversal and has been criticised by black intellectuals and spokespeople. Plus, 50 years from now who knows how such music will be viewed by future generations. Those records and videos could end up being banned years from now, too.

[FleischerFan]

This debate resurfaces here with some regularlity. Before weighing in (yet again) with my opinion, let me deal with some of tristar's more technically-minded questions.

1. "Song of the South" was released on home video in several foreign markets. That's where many of us obtained our copies of the film. The Japanese TV system is compatible with the US system so Japanese VHS tapes and laserdiscs could be played on US equipment. I purchased a copy of the UK edition from a friend who is British and then had another friend in the US convert it to the US television standard. I have since converted my VHS tape to DVD.

2. Disney voluntarily pulled the film from theatrical realease many years ago. As a company that tries to avoid controversy at all cost, they have kept the film off the US market since then.

3. The nature of the contrversy surrounds the character of Uncle Remus - who, while wise and kind, is always subservient to any of the adult white characters in the film. Some view this portrayal as depicting Uncle Remus as an "Uncle Tom" character (referencing "Uncle Tom's Cabin" and its depiction of a subservient African-American character).

4. Disney is totally aware of the film and the fact that they have not given it a US home video release. They are completely aware of the long-running Internet based campaign urging them to release it.

Now, what follows is my opinion:

5. I don't find the film "boring." In fact, it remains one of my favorite of the Disney live action films of that period. I find James Basektt's performance to be very good and Bobby Driscoll (who would later voice Peter Pan) to be a good child actor. The animation is great.

6. That said, taking "offense" is strictly subjective. The film does not offend me, but I can understand why others might be offended. I think a debate about whether or not it is offensive is silly. The real question is whether or not Disney should release the film DESPITE the fact that some might be offended. I think they should.

7. A prominent black film critic/film historian wrote a very passionate piece (last year, I believe) championing the film and urging Disney to release it. We all hope this will help.

8. The fact that Disney has released many of its earlier cartoons with far more offensive racial stereotyping is encouraging to those of us who would like to see the film released.

9. I, too, find the racial stereotyping of "Gone With the Wind" to be offensive. In fact, I find the whole romaticizing of the Southern position in the Civil War to be offensive, but I would never call for M-G-M to pull the film from release. And I agree that "Birth of a Nation" is far and away the most offensive film in a racial sense as it make the Ku Klux Klan the good guys who are justified in lynching blacks. And yes, I have seen the entire film (I majored in film when I was in college).

[classicsJR]

Am I the only one to think that THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO POLITICAL INCORRECTNESS in this movie?
It's the exact contrary, folks!

I do agree. Even my wife says that this is a very heartwarming movie of clean fun and wholesome goodness. Much better than current Disney films, that is for sure. Got this one on DVD recorded I believe off a laserdisc or film. Not sure which one.