Later Fleischer

[Der Captain]

I'm wondering why it is that many of the later Fleischer Studio cartoons like "Animated Antics" and the "Stone Age" series are impossible to find today.

[Geezil]

Legend has it that the Stone Age Cartoons weren't that great to begin with. :confused:

[J Lee]

I'm wondering why it is that many of the later Fleischer Studio cartoons like "Animated Antics" and the "Stone Age" series are impossible to find today. The non-Popeye B&W Fleischer cartoons made in Miami were among the first to disappear from independent TV stations in the 1960s, both because of their general weakness and their monochrome look. Even the weakest entries of the Fleischer Color Classics lasted longer in syndication because they were in color, and independent stations in the 60s were looking for anything in their film libraries that wasn't black and white.

Down the line, their early disappearance made copies of those cartoons less accessable to cartoon buffs and collectors once they (and most of the pre-1950 Famous package) were allowed to go into public domain by National Telefilm Associates.

[A. Leal]

Dash it. I know I recently stumbled upon a copy of "Granite Hotel," I think it was, on one of the many one dollar, no-plastic case DVDs, but dash it, now I can't seem to find it. Still, I can swear at least *one* Stone Age Cartoon is in circulation somewhere.

[Ray Pointer]

In the 1970s, Ivy films had the non-theatrical 16mm distribution rights to the ANIMATED ANTICS series. It was from this period that some dupes may have originated. Many were one shots such as BRING HIMSELF BACK ALIVE, and others were limited sereis with GULLIVER'S TRAVELS characters such as The Three Spies (Sneak, Snoop, and Snitch), and another series with Twinkletoes, the carrier pidgeon. Paramount also acquire the Charlie Bowers stop motion short, MOM AND POP IN WILD OYSTERS for inclusion as a "Max Fleischer Animated Antic."

My recollection of the Animated Antics series was from 1962, while on vaction in Northern Michigan. I don't recall ever seeing them in Detroit television. I recognized the studio's work, but wondered what was wrong since the cartoons were not very good. The animation was interesting, reminiscent of the Popeye cartoons, but not as entertaining, nor did they seem to make any sense.

I have been told that STONE AGE was made in color, but I never saw it in a television package. The one STONE AGE cartoon I've seen was a black and white print, and reminds me of a Warner's Tex Avery travelogue parody. The animation was good, but the basic problem was the character design was awkward and ugly. Had there been more of a stylistic realization then, it could have worked better. Also the characters were not terribly well defined. This as we know was overcome 20 years later when Hanna-Barbera hit the airwaves with THE FLINTSTONES.

[JDWeil]

What I would like to see on DVD would be the later Fleischer two-reelers like Raggedy Ann and Andy and The Raven: A Cartoon Travesty. I don't believe those have been shown recently.

[Sogturtle]

A turtle speaks:D ~

In my 16mm collection are prints of the two-reeler "The Raven" (b&w rather than color, with voice by Pinto Colvig). And on 1958 Kodak stock the Stone Age cartoon "Wedding Belts" and I believe on '58 stock also "Bring Himself Back Alive". Am certain I have "Granite Hotel" on VHS somewhere.


Raggedy Ann And Andy was put out on a lovely VHS tape by NTS in 1983 entitled "All-Star Cartoon Parade" (also on it the Gabby cartoon "The Constable", the first Casper, a late Boop and a Little Lulu toon.

All the Stone Age cartoons were MADE in black and white (according to my research in the U.S. Copyright Catalog back in 1977-78.) :)

[Howard L]

Well, that's one mystery solved: I have been trying to track down "Springtime in the Rock Age" for, well, ages. It aired frequently when I was a kid watching TV in the early 1960s. The fact I am writing about it now gives you an idea of the indelible impression it made i.e. SCARED me.

[absolutpaul]

The Moviola channel in Canada shows Granite Hotel from time to time.

[Geezil]

... "Granite Hotel," for some arcane reason, it's available (and readily so) on this (http://www.amazon.com/Greatest-Sci-Fi-Cartoons/dp/B0000X61X2/sr=8-1/qid=1156984837/ref=sr_1_1/002-2125423-2824021?ie=UTF8) DVD.

[FleischerFan]

Geezil:

Ironically enough, I just purchased a copy of that "Greatest Sci-FI Cartoons" DVD.

I thought the "Stone Age" cartoon was excellent. The gags were sharp - defnitely on a level with some of the better stone age gags in the later Flintstones series. The cartoon seemed to have that same urban edge that made the Fleischer Popeyes and Boops so good. They were definitely better than the attempts by Fleischer to go the Disney route and try to be sweet & sentimental, which was not their strong suit.

The DVD BTW has one heckuva title. I counted 4 lies in it. Four of the 10 shorts are not science fiction in the remotest sense of the word. Two of them are not even cartoons, but stop motion animation.

That said, there are a few interesting entries. In addition to "Granite Hotel," there is a Ray Harryhausen stop-motion "King Midas" short, George Pal's "Jaspar in a Jam," and a Colonel Bleep. There is also the old public school civil defense film "Duck & Cover" which is not science fiction, nor a cartoon (although it does have some very crude animated moments), nor great.

For me, it was worth the price to get the Fleischer cartoon.

I just wish that Ray or Steve or someone of that quality level could assemble a disc of "Animated Antics" & "Stone Age" cartoons with "The Raven" tossed in for good measure. Are we correct in thinking that all these titles have slipped into public domain like most of the rest of the Fleischer non-Popeye catalog?

[Geezil]

Geezil:

Ironically enough, I just purchased a copy of that "Greatest Sci-FI Cartoons" DVD.

I thought the "Stone Age" cartoon was excellent. The gags were sharp - defnitely on a level with some of the better stone age gags in the later Flintstones series. The cartoon seemed to have that same urban edge that made the Fleischer Popeyes and Boops so good. They were definitely better than the attempts by Fleischer to go the Disney route and try to be sweet & sentimental, which was not their strong suit.

The DVD BTW has one heckuva title. I counted 4 lies in it. Four of the 10 shorts are not science fiction in the remotest sense of the word. Two of them are not even cartoons, but stop motion animation.

That said, there are a few interesting entries. In addition to "Granite Hotel," there is a Ray Harryhausen stop-motion "King Midas" short, George Pal's "Jaspar in a Jam," and a Colonel Bleep. There is also the old public school civil defense film "Duck & Cover" which is not science fiction, nor a cartoon (although it does have some very crude animated moments), nor great.

For me, it was worth the price to get the Fleischer cartoon.

I just wish that Ray or Steve or someone of that quality level could assemble a disc of "Animated Antics" & "Stone Age" cartoons with "The Raven" tossed in for good measure. Are we correct in thinking that all these titles have slipped into public domain like most of the rest of the Fleischer non-Popeye catalog?

FleischerFan/Bill:

Yes to almost all of the above. Plus, Colonel Bleep would be a great archaeological find for any fan of Ren & Stimpy, Season One, who has never seen the Bleepmeister in any form.

I'll happily consent to let your Fleischer non-Popeye concerns be passed along to Steve or Ray for the addressing, though! My own PD plate is incredibly full these days. ;)

[MarkTheShark]

... "Granite Hotel," for some arcane reason, it's available (and readily so) on this (http://www.amazon.com/Greatest-Sci-Fi-Cartoons/dp/B0000X61X2/sr=8-1/qid=1156984837/ref=sr_1_1/002-2125423-2824021?ie=UTF8) DVD.

This is so funny, I hope you'll forgive me for digging up this thread.

You guys have got me curious now. I know I have seen this DVD a hundred times and never even gave it a second look...now that I know it has a semi-obscure Fleischer toon on it, I can't find it anywhere. I'll keep looking.

But I went to the link to the Amazon page...there is this person who posted a review (from Canada) saying they were part of the "restoration team" that worked on this and other Goodtimes DVDs...remember those "Lost Cartoons" DVDs which are supposed to be meticulously "restored," etc., but then they have for instance, on the Famous Studios volume, the Buzzy cartoon "Stupidstitious Cat" with the wrong titles on it, with the name of the wrong cartoon ("Pleased To Eat You," a different cartoon altogether) and the title card is in black and white to boot? And the Van Beuren DVD with Ub Iwerks cartoons on it?

Well, check this out...this person has posted nearly identical reviews for a whole bunch of these shoddy DVDs:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/cdp/member-reviews/A3QKHRRJ3J09QE/102-8268813-7488963?ie=UTF8&display=public&page=2

I especially enjoyed this remark in the Greatest Sci-Fi Cartoons review, and I quote:

"We obviously couldn't have every Sci Fi cartoon of all time on this volumne and we were limited to whats available to restore thats also in the public domain but I have noticed some mixed reviews about this product with most of the negative ones being ghost written by our competition so i wanted to tell everyone the real truth about this product since we are the people who produced it. I am using my wifes Amazon account to post this."

But then look at the bottom of the second page, the last review (for something called "Biggest Wednesday"):

"I bought this DVD last week and i'm not happy to announce that the quality is terrible, it looks like it was shot on 16mm, its blurry, poor resolution and half the film is shots of guys talking. Big Wednesday is a Big Disappointment and i don't recomend buying this DVD. The PBS special on nova was much better.":buzzy:

They could use spell check and an AP style book too.

[Jon Cooke]

If anyone is looking for a copy of Fleischer's THE RAVEN. It's on a DVD out there now (it's actually been out since 2004 it seems) called GRAMPA'S SILLY SCARIES from a company called Passport Video. It is apparently a reissue of a 1980s public domain cartoon compilation hosted by Al "Grampa Munster" Lewis. It is mostly standard PD fare ("Fright to the Finish" with Popeye, "Cobweb Hotel", etc). It's not the best print in the world, but I was happy to finally get a chance to see it! It is available to rent from Netflix and Amazon has it.
http://www.goldenagecartoons.com/raven01.jpg
http://www.goldenagecartoons.com/raven02.jpg
http://www.goldenagecartoons.com/raven03.jpg

[MarkTheShark]

If anyone is looking for a copy of Fleischer's THE RAVEN. It's on a DVD out there now (it's actually been out since 2004 it seems) called GRAMPA'S SILLY SCARIES from a company called Passport Video. It is apparently a reissue of a 1980s public domain cartoon compilation hosted by Al "Grampa Munster" Lewis. It is mostly standard PD fare ("Fright to the Finish" with Popeye, "Cobweb Hotel", etc). It's not the best print in the world, but I was happy to finally get a chance to see it! It is available to rent from Netflix and Amazon has it.

Yet another one I have passed by a dozen times and haven't seen lately. D'oh!