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View Full Version : OT: Animated Sitcoms in Desperate Need of Reform


Mr. Semaj
03-06-2009, 05:40 PM
This wouldn't be news to some, and the only animated sitcoms around today are on FOX Sundays. But aside from the fact all four entries have the same basic nuclear family premise, they have run into creative ruts, whether brought up or not, that has made Sunday-night viewings increasingly cumbersome.

The Simpsons: One of the cornerstones of the Silver Age of Animation, which has developed a more profound impact in American pop culture than any modern television cartoon. Even long after droves of fans expressed concerns for the latest episodes, The Simpsons Movie went on to make a lot of money, which is usually not the case for any feature film based from a TV series.
But the series has been on the air for almost 20 years, and most fans consider the golden years, roughly the first eight years, to have long passed. Rightfully, much of the show's original creative staff exited during its ninth year, and that was when the general frame of mind seemed to change. Thanks to Mike Scully, episodes became wackier, and much of what was part of the series' canon was being ignored by leaps and bounds. Al Jean stepped up again, and tried to bring the series back to earth. But now, the concensus is that the episodes have become too bland, still utilize questionable storylines, or stretch short jokes out for too long.
While I agree more about the Jean years than the Scully years, concerning season-by-season quality, it has reached the point where one can no longer argue with fans who want the series to end sooner than later.

King of the Hill: Another show that has been around for a long time. Except most people wouldn't know, because FOX has kept it in an obscure time slot for most of its run, even trying to cancel it every so often. Only three years ago, the show was about to end the exact same way Futurama ended.
While this show has come off much luckier than its contemporaries, it was not without some creative problems of its own. Mike Judge had a feeling that the writing was getting lazy by its fourth or fifth year, where Hank was being pushed around too much, Peggy had become insanely egotistic, and Bobby was becoming a wimp. Even when the staff was rearranged by its seventh year, it only made scant difference. Episodes for the next few years would become increasingly boring, and many secondary characters that have come to establish Arlen where phased out as the show took on a fill-in-the-blank type structure on a regular basis.
Ever since almost getting cancelled three years ago, the show's staff was completely rebooted, and the stories became a little stronger. But on the whole, they still retain the same fill-in-the-blank structure from recent times. With the show finally bowing out this season, it could be said that it has been on autopilot.

Family Guy: One of the most controversial shows of our time. This was another victim of FOX's poor programming skills, having been cancelled once after a previous attempt during its first few years. Popular demand brought it back some time later. Even during the early years, many people have criticized the show for its bad art and plagarized stories, when really, the show was doing the same as The Simpsons where it basically turned sitcom and cartoon cliches upside-down.
Nowadays, the show is no longer in danger of cancellation, but many long-time fans, including myself, have become increasingly aware of the problems that have prevailed since its comeback. A lot of the charm it once had, where its subversive humor was out to prove a point, has become crudeness for its own sake. Now more than ever, characters have become vehicles for throwaway references and writers' commentary (not so much legitimate Mary Sues). Many writers, including Alex Borstein, have mistaken these changes for evolution, and sadly, many fans simply repeat everything the show expects them to believe.
It can be assumed that the writers are resting on their laurels. Seth MacFarlane is now the highest-paid writer for television, and nothing in the forseeable future can change that. So, how do they repay the same fans who helped keep the show alive during its cancelled years? Total sabotage.
To me, FG has the same problem as King of the Hill where, once it finds that comfort zone, they crawl towards a fixed formula. Most stories today consist of Peter, Cleveland, Quagmire, and Joe getting into trouble, or something going on between Brian and Stewie, usually involving Stewie's on-off homosexuality. A lot of secondary characters that are ripe for development have been ignored for years, which makes their additions in the first place completely pointless.

American Dad: Most people will disagree with me on this, but this is actually the freshest program in the FOX Sunday night lineup. Sure, it has the same art as FG, but this show has had a lot of what has been missing from its predeccesor these days; strong characters, funny jokes, and consistent storytelling, along with an occasional story going deeper into some of the characters' lives. Just as well, much of the show's producers were leftover from FG's glory years.
Yet, this show has from the beginning been doomed to live in Family Guy's shadow. Part of its conception was to continue FG's line of humor, before that show's revival, and it is because of that this show has always been paired up with its brother series, never gaining any critical or popular acclaim, and seldom promoted by FOX marketing outside the fact that it's another MacFarlane show.
Which is shameful, because while the show was also conceived as a parody of Bush-era politics, having debuted in the wake of Bush's second term, American Dad has tried to find a life of its own. Any recent episode rarely mentions anything regarding the Bush administration, which makes it stick out much less in that regard in the wake of Obama's first term.

Futurama: Here was a show that shot for something totally different. This was the one animated sitcom focused more on the workspace than the family, and has established its own line of humor, commentary, and social messages that made for an intelligent series.
None of that was realized by FOX, which phased out on the series before cancelling it altogether. Futurama has recently enjoyed a slower but steady revival on DVD, formerly Adult Swim, and now Comedy Central. This has FOX talking about greenlighting it for a new season. However, going by their treatment of Family Guy, not only has FOX developed a habit of ignoring potentially successful products, opting for someone else to nurture it instead, but some critiques of the DVD movies has Futurama every bit as suspectible to a creative meltdown as is currently happening with Family Guy. Two things that have to be kept in mind.

There's a lot more to be said about some upcoming shows, including FOX's Sit Down, Shut Up and The Cleveland Show, and ABC's The Goode Family, but I'd like to go further into the current programs. Maybe it coincides with the decline of the American sitcom in general, but isn't it time today's (remaining) sitcom writers try something different? To try reaching for material that goes beyond the (lowest of the) lowest common denominator for a change?

cbrubaker
03-06-2009, 05:59 PM
Animated sitcoms tends to focus more on writing and dialogues, with less focus on the style and visuals itself. Often times it's a hit or miss to me, depending on the show.

I'm actually looking forward to Sit Down, Shut Up, though. Looks good from what I've heard.

Mr. Semaj
03-06-2009, 06:30 PM
I too am looking forward to Sit Down, Shut Up, where it's set to take King of the Hill's spot next month with something potentially new on the table.

But from what I've heard, people seem to be banking more on The Cleveland Show, which Seth has guaranteed will be more of the same stuff we're already getting from Family Guy.

I for one am not ready to watch a FOX lineup with three Seth MacFarlane programs.

Der Captain
03-06-2009, 06:50 PM
American Dad: Most people will disagree with me on this, but this is actually the freshest program in the FOX Sunday night lineup. Sure, it has the same art as FG, but this show has had a lot of what has been missing from its predeccesor these days; strong characters, funny jokes, and consistent storytelling, along with an occasional story going deeper into some of the characters' lives. Just as well, much of the show's producers were leftover from FG's glory years.
Yet, this show has from the beginning been doomed to live in Family Guy's shadow. Part of its conception was to continue FG's line of humor, before that show's revival, and it is because of that this show has always been paired up with its brother series, never gaining any critical or popular acclaim, and seldom promoted by FOX marketing outside the fact that it's another MacFarlane show.
Which is shameful, because while the show was also conceived as a parody of Bush-era politics, having debuted in the wake of Bush's second term, American Dad has tried to find a life of its own. Any recent episode rarely mentions anything regarding the Bush administration, which makes it stick out much less in that regard in the wake of Obama's first term.



Well, I for one will completely agree with you. In fact, I thought that "torture telethon" show was one for the books. One of the reasons AD hasn't risen to greater prominance in the public eye is that "Family Guy" gets all the press. In addition, dedicated MacFarlene-bashers tend to mechanically dismiss the show as FG's "dud companion", leaving me to wonder if any of them have actually watched a single episode. It's less unique than "Family Guy", but more dependable and solidly structured.

The Silver Fox
03-07-2009, 01:54 AM
on all the shows, Only King of the Hill I am going to be sad to see end
its run.
I lived in a small City In Texas in the early to very mid 80's, the show
reminds me alot of the way of life there, but Arlen could be any small City
in Texas. A pretty good show but its time has come to bow.

I am hoping the Simpsons will end in the next year or 2, its run has ran,
it should have ended in 96 or 99, but they wanted to surpase "GunSmoke"
record of the longest running series, which ran from the mid 50's till 1975 and almost in to 76, if a certain exct wife at CBS would have had her way.
They will never surpase the current record of the longest shows which are
The Today Show, CBS News, or The Price is Right.

Family Guy in the last few years have been going down, but hard to say
to see what will happen to the show.

American Dad I have not been that crazy about since it premired a few years ago and now with Bush out of Office, its time also my be numbered as well with a new president in office.

Even South Park not mentioned here, has also ran its course and should soon be ended as well. Even All in the Family (which SP tends to mimic with CArtman) ended after its 10 year run.

CueBallCat79
03-07-2009, 08:19 AM
Oh I get it. This is a "bash everything that airs on FOX sunday nights" thread, right?

And what does Bush not being in office have to do with the quality of American Dad? You act like the show survived on nothing but Republican and Bush jokes.

Mr. Semaj
03-07-2009, 12:45 PM
Oh I get it. This is a "bash everything that airs on FOX sunday nights" thread, right?

I'm not one of those who attacks programs without the courtesy of watching them first. I've watched all of the above-mentioned programs for years, and have seen changes in every last one of them. This is mostly about the less favorable trends that have affected the overall quality and general reception of each program.

Part of my frustration comes from most of the shows catering to fans who can't handle constructive criticism, which turns what were once small problems into big ones. Case in point, the number of mediocre Simpsons episodes slowly outnumbering the good episodes.

And what does Bush not being in office have to do with the quality of American Dad? You act like the show survived on nothing but Republican and Bush jokes.

I already credited American Dad as the best in FOX's current line-up, exactly because the show has found life beyond short-term political humor. The fact that it did will make the show more reliable in the time to come. Today, most of the political humor is being handled by Family Guy, though much less artfully.

Der Captain
03-07-2009, 12:47 PM
Oh I get it. This is a "bash everything that airs on FOX sunday nights" thread, right?


So far no one has knocked EVERY show on FOX. Everyone has singled out an exception or two. Although I like "American Dad" best of the bunch, I also enjoy "Family Guy" from time to time, although it can be extremely uneven. (It works best when the non sequitur cutaway gags are kept short and to the point.) "The Simpsons" used to be the best thing in TV, but everything has a shelf life and it's no longer a must-see. It's best years are behind it. The same goes, to some extent, with KOTH.

Never warmed up much to "Futurama". It's well-written, but the only truly interesting character is the robot. Fry seems like the poor man's Homer Simpson.

"South Park" counts as an animated sitcom, as much as Parker and Stone hate that word, and so far it shows no sign of slowing down.

CueBallCat79
03-07-2009, 12:58 PM
"South Park" counts as an animated sitcom, as much as Parker and Stone hate that word, and so far it shows no sign of slowing down.

I seem to be the only one who thinks South Park is second only to The Simpsons as far as shows I really think need to end are concerned. Many times I find new SP episodes to be even worse than new Simpsons.

It must be nice to be able to work less than four months out of the year and have a TV show that you can use as your soap box for all your political and religious beliefs. IMHO Trey Parker and Matt Stone are textbook definitions of the Hollywood sell-outs who thrive in the very environment they complain about.

I can't enjoy SP anymore because every episode is a thinly veiled attack against something that usually doesn't deserve it.

Matt the Y
03-07-2009, 01:12 PM
It must be nice to be able to work less than four months out of the year and have a TV show that you can use as your soap box for all your political and religious beliefs. IMHO Trey Parker and Matt Stone are textbook definitions of the Hollywood sell-outs who thrive in the very environment they complain about.

I can't enjoy SP anymore because every episode is a thinly veiled attack against something that usually doesn't deserve it.

Hear! Hear! I've waited my whole life to hear someone else say this and think this about SP! Now someone finally has! Thanks so much, Mike!

Mind you, I've always felt this way about SP which is why I've never felt comfortable about the show at all or had any fondness or feelings toward the show other than animosity whatsoever but, judging from what you're saying here, now things are getting even worse regarding it. Siiiiiiiiiggghhhh..... Still, at least, with your post, now someone else actually recognizes that.

nickramer
03-07-2009, 01:50 PM
Yeah, SP can go too far sometimes. I didn't like how they made fun of Chris Reeve and that egg cell incident, espically since it aired sometime before his death. How does Trey and Matt sleep at night?

cbrubaker
03-07-2009, 01:56 PM
Let me chime in and say that "American Dad" isn't that bad, either. The animation sucks and the writing can be hit-or-miss, but when it hits, it really hits.

I like the characters in this show more than in Family Guy.

Ray Pointer
03-07-2009, 08:20 PM
Hear! Hear! I've waited my whole life to hear someone else say this and think this about SP! Now someone finally has! Thanks so much, Mike!Mind you, I've always felt this way about SP which is why I've never felt comfortable about the show at all or had any fondness or feelings toward the show other than animosity whatsoever but, judging from what you're saying here, now things are getting even worse regarding it. Siiiiiiiiiggghhhh..... Still, at least, with your post, now someone else actually recognizes that.

You aren't alone is expressing concerns about SOUTH PARK. I stuck my neck out a number of years ago by recognizing the overall cynicism of this show's "creators" who made an entire episode focused on a piece of manure. This is a not so thinly disguised statement about what they are producing and what the creators think will sell. Unfortunately the industry thought this was funny. But the funniest thing is that the creators are the ones who are laughing the loudest, having been awarded an Emmy over concepts that normally would be flushed down the toilet. "Out of sight, out of 'mind'."

Vdubdavid
03-11-2009, 10:24 PM
I can't enjoy SP anymore because every episode is a thinly veiled attack against something that usually doesn't deserve it.

You ain't kiddin. I'm watching the newest episode right now; Mickey? Really? That's all you got, SP? What did he ever do to you guys?

nickramer
03-11-2009, 10:43 PM
You ain't kiddin. I'm watching the newest episode right now; Mickey? Really? That's all you got, SP? What did he ever do to you guys?
Which Mickey did they poke of? The Mouse?

cbrubaker
03-11-2009, 10:44 PM
Which Mickey did they poke of? The Mouse?
Yeah. SP animated Mickey Mouse as the Disney boss, forcing the Jonas Brothers to wear purity rings.

Thought it was funny, though. Evil Mickey's rant near the end was so true.

nickramer
03-11-2009, 10:48 PM
Brother! See if Cartman would be around in 80 years.

Thad
03-11-2009, 10:50 PM
They made fun of a cartoon character and you're all up in arms? Put up a couple more boards on the window, you're not ready for human interaction yet.

nickramer
03-11-2009, 10:53 PM
They made fun of a cartoon character and you're all up in arms? Put up a couple more boards on the window, you're not ready for human interaction yet.
Thad, do you have to be so cynical to other members?

Tom Stathes
03-11-2009, 11:42 PM
What's this lashing out at Thad's attempt at humor? At least, that's how it came across to me.

nickramer
03-11-2009, 11:44 PM
What's this lashing out at Thad's attempt at humor? At least, that's how it came across to me.
Yeah, but it felt like he was poking fun of me.

Tom Stathes
03-11-2009, 11:48 PM
Thad tells me he has bigger clams to bake. I think he was just making a generic pun.

nickramer
03-11-2009, 11:50 PM
Thad tells me he has bigger clams to bake. I think he was just making a generic pun.
Well, it was a pretty bad pun.

Tom Stathes
03-12-2009, 12:20 AM
Flat out insulting someone for expressing an opinion is being humorous?

I didn't notice a smiley or some other recognizable indicator of non-seriousness in Thad's post, so he must have not been joking around. Believe it or not, he's done that before.

With all due respect to both you and Thad, as you are both frequent and respected posters here at GAC, it could simply have been an oversight of Thad's not to include a smilie that would indicate humor. We all make mistakes like this on occasion.

Leviathan
03-12-2009, 12:32 AM
Okay. I'll drop it if everyone else will.

nickramer
03-12-2009, 12:34 AM
I'll stop it too.

Larry T
03-13-2009, 09:15 AM
Thanks for keeping it above the wire, guys :)

As far as the thread goes, I personally think the Simpsons has lived its run, and at the same time has evolved into that dull, easy, single-faceted humour that allowed it to stay alive on TV. Like Matt and many others here, I personally enjoy the Tracey Ullman-up-to-Season 5 episodes the most and I think those were the best representations of what the show should be seen as. Nowadays, I'm glad that the writers went back to focusing the episode on Homer and the other members of the Simpson family, because for a while there, they strayed too much by relying on visitors to or citizens of Springfield to fill a episode's content, and I pretty much figured that was the beginning of the end.
But for the sake of argument, I don't watch it anymore expecting to be fantastically impressed or to even remember much of it after it's over... I just want a few laughs and get on with my evening.... and I think that's the bare minimum the writers shoot for as well by now.... so everybody's satisfied.

Family Guy is another matter- if I can bring myself to sit through an entire episode nowadays, when it's over I feel like I have been raped of 1/2 hr of my time. When that show premiered it was the funniest, most biting animated satire on the tube- now it's a downright abomination, and the problem lies solely with its creator. Seth McFarlane is the most unfunny, arrogant, immature, Gd-Damned conceited SOB in Hollywood. He truly believes he has created a subversive vein of humour which he considers funny, by poking fun at things he knows absolutely nothing about and in itself that's supposed to be funny, but in effect is just childish. If you watch any interviews about the guy, you will clearly see that given his title of 'highest-paid' writer, his attitude is a smug, self-fulfilled sophomoric jackass. And this comes through loud and clear in the show's content: You can tell the very second the writing team steps aside and McFarlane takes over, because the humour will suddenly turn from something that's actually going somewhere to a simplified version of "you know what's stupid? You. Nyah nyah you're stupid because you're not me. Farty poopy gay boogerhead, ha ha, that's funny and if you don't think so, that's what you are." That show should be canceled for good this time, and never brought back.

I'll agree with the comments on South Park as well, although I still watch it from time to time because again, I don't expect much, just a small validation of the 1/2 hour I spent to watch it by getting a few laughs. Parker and Stone are truly capable of very funny stuff, but they don't always use this to the show's advantage. Couple that with their incorporating topical humour too much and they give each episode a shelf life of less than a few months. Before they were given the show's renewal a few years back, they had actually planned on ending South Park once and for all by killing all the characters off, which I would have liked to see- because it was pretty much ending its run by then and doing so would have closed it in a timely manner.... but I guess, if I were writing a series and were offered to keep it alive so that I would keep raking in the cash, I would do the exact same thing as they did :) .

I never really warmed up to Futurama, American Dad nor KOTH at all, so I can't comment on those... I saw them too much as pale manifestations of previously successful concepts.

WoodpeckerWoody
03-13-2009, 10:08 AM
Its, allways funny when I hear pepole talk about this animated sitcoms as only adult cartoons ever made its makes me :confused: and when pepole hears about :bugs2: :daffy: :tomcat: :jerry: :droopy: :donald: :mickey: :woody: :magoo: :sailor: :thinkpink :felix:
etc. then they says those are for kids, at lest here in Iceland. With that aside. I think those animated sitcoms we are talking about here shows are rather flat and thin in general, as some one said few months ago, they (the producers) could have done an radio show any way sinc the drawings are as liminated as they can get.
If I would rank this stuff then it would be;

1. The Simpsons
2. Family Guy
3. Futurama
4. King of Hill
5. American Dad




BOOMB: South Park

Matt the Y
03-13-2009, 11:34 AM
Family Guy is another matter- if I can bring myself to sit through an entire episode nowadays, when it's over I feel like I have been raped of 1/2 hr of my time. When that show premiered it was the funniest, most biting animated satire on the tube- now it's a downright abomination, and the problem lies solely with its creator. Seth McFarlane is the most unfunny, arrogant, immature, Gd-Damned conceited SOB in Hollywood. He truly believes he has created a subversive vein of humour which he considers funny, by poking fun at things he knows absolutely nothing about and in itself that's supposed to be funny, but in effect is just childish. If you watch any interviews about the guy, you will clearly see that given his title of 'highest-paid' writer, his attitude is a smug, self-fulfilled sophomoric jackass. And this comes through loud and clear in the show's content: You can tell the very second the writing team steps aside and McFarlane takes over, because the humour will suddenly turn from something that's actually going somewhere to a simplified version of "you know what's stupid? You. Nyah nyah you're stupid because you're not me. Farty poopy gay boogerhead, ha ha, that's funny and if you don't think so, that's what you are." That show should be canceled for good this time, and never brought back.


I love your comments on MacFarlane here, Larry! And, for that matter, I'm glad I haven't seen any interviews with MacFarlane because that would just make me hate the man and his show even more than I already do now! Too much fame, money, and wealth can truly go too far.....

AnthroCoon
03-13-2009, 11:45 AM
I did see the SP episode online via the official site and there were funny moments, laugh out loud even. Part of it obviously comes from hearing Mickey spout profanity and such (sim. to when we get meltdowns from usually good-natured, clean performers--
Casey Kasem's outtake tape comes to mind) Haven't seen it much but I've heard that SP can be an equal opportunity skewer/offender, though sometimes/often the ones getting skewed are on the Left (also see Team America, where those on the Left were
aghast at the lampooning of beloved Hollywood figures etc.) One of the SP guys was quoted in the book "South Park Conservatives" as saying that "We hate conservatives but we really bleeping hate liberals". There ya go! (for record I
am conservative on many issues, liberal on a couple; a "Dennis Miller" type)

I have liked FG in the past and have the first six (!) boxed sets but it's wearing on me. Same old same old.
Meanwhile on the Right, the Parents' Television Council objected strongly to the most recent FG episode saying it shouldn't have aired during the so-called
family hour and that it showed disturbing images to its "young audience" (that's
right, folks, Family Guy is perfect for young kids! Only young kids watch!
Never mind the D-L-S-V etc. warnings at the start of the episode!

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/erin-brown/2009/03/11/fox-gay-sex-bible-bashing-apparently-ok-kids#comments